Oscar
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Mark: [00:00:00] Hi there and welcome to episode 10, I think it is now, of the Gentle Revolution Podcast where we are seeking to connect people with purpose. And by purpose I mean higher purpose and higher purpose, as I hope you'll come to understand, is achieved through the pursuit of personal peace. This episode has been one of my favorite.
I say that every episode, but. I'm pulling out some big guns now. This is an an interview with Dr. Oscar Serralach, who is well known to many people. I think he was in Goop once. Uh, he is an amazing medical doctor who reinvigorated my passion for the potential of medicine as many of us have seen. No doubt.
Modern medicine has had some twists and turns, which have made it unfortunately a little bit less respected and trusted, [00:01:00] uh, by many. But what I learned through working in fact with. Oscar Serralach for a period of time and collaborating with him. He's been my student and co-facilitator. We've studied yoga nidra together and have a shared interest, which comes across, I think quite strongly in this episode where we talk about yoga nidra as a tool, as in many ways a panacea for so many ailments.
Oscar. And he discussed this at length in the episode, works a lot with postpartum mothers, women who have been through childbirth and are depleted for many, many reasons. And he points again and again to yoga nidra. And the science absolutely supports this yoga nidra as a tool for giving us that deep rest, that deep invigoration that so many need.
Women who have just had babies, obviously, uh, are mostly significantly depleted through that process and need support from the [00:02:00] community, but also through practice and yoga. nidra is an amazing tool. It's been such a pleasure to chat with Oscar in this episode. Uh, I've just finished editing it and I'm really touched and moved.
Oscar. Participated in a number of courses with me a few years ago, and we discussed this in the episode. He came to Bali where I am right now, and he did a, an intensive 50 hour training now level one meditation training and then continued on through level two. Uh, and it was such a pleasure to have him as a student, honor, in fact, to have him as a student.
But I learned, have, and continue to learn through so much through the process, his passion for science, but his open-mindedness around what's possible with these practices inspires me, and I think it'll inspire you. I hope you enjoy the episode. If you are interested in joining one of our trainings, we do have our meditation breath work, yoga nidra teacher training, running at the end of August, 2025 at the Byron Yoga Center [00:03:00] as an intensive course, and also online from the beginning of September.
2025. Uh, if you listen to this episode after that, then you can check our website and find current dates. , It's such a pleasure to teach this course, to share my love of the practice, and particularly yoga nidra. I've seen it change the lives of so many. I've experienced it changing my life, having a sustainable, nurturing practice to carry us through whatever the times are.
It truly is a gift for the ages, which I'm fortunate, grateful to have in my own life. And, . So honored to be able to pay forward to so many other people, Oscar Serralach included. So I hope you enjoyed the episode. Please do share and follow, subscribe, all those things and let me know what you think.
I really do love to hear
warm, welcome to Dr. Oscar Serralach. Welcome to the Gentle Revolution podcast. I am so stoked to have you here. I'm, I'm excited. I've got a lot of stuff that I wanna [00:04:00] talk to you about. I love our conversations
Oscar Serrallach: It's real honored to be on your podcast mark but you've been quite an inspiration for me over the years in my sort of own personal development So it's circle and then and as you're alluding to we get to nerd out in public it's great
Mark: Yeah, it's cool. Look, I'd like to give you a little bit of an introduction, so, and just explain to the, to the good folk at home who I think you are. And then I'm gonna invite you to expand their awareness. So it gives you a bit of an insight as to what I know about you. So you are Dr. Oscar Serralach you are a medical doctor, a general practitioner with something now of a specialization in postpartum wellbeing for women which is a, a very cool to tangent that.
I guess it's just the evolution of your journey. You, you, when I met you, you were working as a and you still are working as a functional medical doctor at the health lodge. And [00:05:00] some people won't know what functional medical doctors are or what they do, and I'm gonna ask you to explain that in a little while.
But I'll just say this, meeting, you as a functional medical doctor reinvigorated my excitement around the medical profession and what was possible. But you've also got another really important aspect of your life and I mean, I'm sure you don't divide it up, but you're a yogi and a meditator and, and someone who's really deeply passionate about a path of personal wellbeing.
And you have an amazing wife who is kind of a superhuman, really not, not denying it, pretty special. Carolyn Cowley, who is. An incredible bhakti yogi who really resonates powerfully within our community and brings mantra forward. And, and that's a part of your world. We, we have studied together. And it's [00:06:00] interesting because I, when I first met you, I was learning so much from you about polyvagal.
You were the first person to actually introduce me to polyvagal theory. And then we started speaking about yoga nidra over the years when we were working together at the health lodge. And then you came and studied with me, which was a great honor and to have you join me for, of course, in Bali and then continue on when we, we finished our meditation and training and our yoga, specifically our Yoga Nidra training.
So it was really wonderful to have you doing that course and to share your wisdom within that forum. And what's really, I mean, there's many things I like about your Oscar. But one of the things that you and I always love to jam on is this practice of yoga nidra. So I obviously really wanna talk about that today.
So I'm gonna start throwing you some questions and some openings. And I would like you perhaps to begin just to extrapolate a little bit on your [00:07:00] journey as a medical doctor. How did you get into medicine? Why did you get into medicine? And what path did that take you on?
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah that's I'll make a long story relatively short mark But yeah it's always interested in human biology at high school and it was almost a natural extension to does you know human biology take us I was interested in the body I was lucky that my marks were quite good at high school so I got into medical school and I realized in medical school it it's a system that's really trying to shape people to be operating the medical system And that was the main focus And you are learning human science as part of that And so I I was always a little bit going I'm learning more about how to operate in the system than I am This is about human biology in the human sciences But they both happening in in tandem And after I graduated from [00:08:00] medical school I became a little bit of a medical gypsy But I wasn't really finding my place in the medical world I was I was just doing locum work I was I tried indigenous health I tried addiction medicine I tried all different types of I was actually trained to be a psychiatrist for a couple of years Not many people
Mark: okay.
Oscar Serrallach: me And again
Mark: Okay.
Oscar Serrallach: But it was like I don't wanna be a psychiatrist I'm really interested in mental health But
Mark: So an abiding interest in the mind. That's always been there.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah Yeah what makes us tick essentially what motivates us because
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: was really aware of is health behavior
Mark: Yeah. So Cool. Yeah. Why we do what we do.
Oscar Serrallach: Exactly And most of the people that I ended up just going to emergency medicine cause I felt that was the most honest aspect of medicine in terms of research
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: feel like you're doing a great job
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: you
Mark: We are good at it.
Oscar Serrallach: well we are really good at [00:09:00] it and there's no pretense behind emergency medicine and there's no
Mark: Mm.
Oscar Serrallach: that you're actually healing people just fixing them but
Mark: Yeah, yeah,
Oscar Serrallach: Or
Mark: yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: whereas
Mark: Keep them breathing,
Oscar Serrallach: yeah Yeah
Mark: know.
Oscar Serrallach: And then But when I started a family I was I can't really be doing emergency medicine forever because it's a lot of night duties and rosters and and so I started getting into sort of general practice And when we look at chronic disease management that's all it is We're managing it not actually treating it And then I got quite frustrated because you could see things like health behaviors and as a GP there was just a lot of bandaid sort of stuff going on cause one you don't have the time one you don't have the resources in terms of being able to refer people on to people that would really help fixing journey in a yoga prescription not prescription In the GP world for example it's just sort of a recommendation But under the guise of exercise essentially
Mark: [00:10:00] Yes. Yeah. Yeah. We generally think it's a nice thing to do. We're not quite sure why, because we've actually, probably, most of us have never done it, but we read somewhere that there is some evidence to support that. A, some sort of yoga practice is generally a positive thing. I think that's basically the, the recommendation, which is good.
It's better than none. None,
Oscar Serrallach: I've talked to GPS and they talk about it like like it's group exercise and it is that but plus much much more obviously
Mark: of course. Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: and so in my very early start with GP medicine I started getting into it was initially called nutritional and environmental medicine which
Is integrative medicine which is also functional medicine So what the difference really is you're looking at all the disease processes that medicine focuses on So that's
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: ignore that It's actually the core part but then you are looking at all the influences And so the influences are nutrition the environment so things like toxins in our environment and you're trying to [00:11:00] look at things in a more to use an over banded word holistically rather than just in a linear model which is modern medicine And it does a very good job at linear but it's not very good at sort of systems thinking And we now know with all the latest research interconnected The vagal system the microbiome and our health You can't differentiate one from the other
Mark: Yeah. Yeah. I do wanna talk to you about those two specific things. In fact, the vagus nerve and the microbiome. And just to sort of date our understanding, and we have spoken on this podcast before about Polyvagal Theory I actually had a great chat with Simon Dubois about polyvagal theory not so long ago.
So I won't ask you to give the full download of it because the information is public. But what I'm really interested in is, I, [00:12:00] you were the first person, as I mentioned before, who introduced me to Polyvagal theory. I remember hearing you talking about it at a team meeting at the health lodge, and I was like, oh, that sounds really interesting.
And at that time, I just assumed that I'd missed something and that you, you guys had, you know, been working with this for a long time. And that was probably about 2016, 2017, 18, whatever it was. And I realized subsequently, in fact, it was really new research that it had only just been published that Deb Dana had, in fact only really just started, and Steven Porges had really only just started pushing out this information into the public sphere.
So you were, had probably only just taken it on yourself and you were integrating it into your understanding. And it, for me, it was just like, well, as a, as a yogi, as a yoga practitioner, as a yoga teacher, and particularly someone with a focus on relaxation yoga and yoga nidra specifically and pranayama, that it was like, wow, okay.
It's so deeply validates what we do and, and provides this [00:13:00] increasingly credible scientific understanding, which really clearly proves why this stuff is so good for us.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah Yeah a hundred percent and I think that's why I just resonated with polyvagal theory because it really backed up what I was experiencing and what I was observing and that it also provided a pathway in terms of improving people's health through nervous system regulation
Mark: Hmm. Stress people don't heal.
Oscar Serrallach: Exactly and to be honest most of my work now fundamentally is around nervous system recuperation As you mentioned
Mark: Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: focus is on helping mothers in the years after birth and their nervous system has been through a battering And so for me polyvagal theory is a bit of a Trojan horse in some ways to enable one the validation as you mentioned and then also a path forward Because what I often tell my clients is that there is no magic pill [00:14:00] but there's a magic approach
Mark: it.
Oscar Serrallach: and the magic approach starts with understanding a little bit about the nervous system And fascinating for me about the nervous system we've all got one we've all been using our nervous system our whole lives and it's like a language It's like we just learn the language from our home But when you start to get into polyvagal theory you realize oh my goodness this language can be written down It's got grammar it's got syntax
Mark: Can be spoken and I can express.
Oscar Serrallach: what And I can also learn a new dialect Of nervous system if nervous system was a language because the dialect that we often learn as kids is can be just reactive or shut down or don't talk about our problems or don't learn healthy nervous system regulation most of the time especially in Western culture And and I think we [00:15:00] intuitively know yes I can understand that my nervous system is out of kilter And I'll share a story with you mark I don't know if I've actually told you this in the early days when I was working with mothers I was just trying everything that was safe but just trying everything and it was be fish oil or magnesium and herbs and then I'd ask my mothers What would you give the gold Star to out of everything that we've done and almost universally it was yoga nidra And this was going back I don't know 12 years or something like that And
Mark: Okay.
Oscar Serrallach: and I'm almost ashamed to say it I was like damn yoga nidra again I want the real thing I being a doctor one ill one
Mark: Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: no what's the capsule What Yoga Nidra doesn't work on a prescription pad
Mark: Yeah. It doesn't work. There's no business model for [00:16:00] Yoga Nidra, unfortunately.
Oscar Serrallach: But
Mark: That
Oscar Serrallach: like it's a harder sell in terms
Mark: yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: clients
Mark: have to do. Something you have to do.
Oscar Serrallach: And then something you need to get some practice in
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: going to feel
After one session No there's almost a momentum that sort of happens And this was one of the breakthroughs doing your course mark was actually taking it further and getting a much deeper understanding myself and this experience of so many mothers saying yoga nidra just that reworked for me and the magnesium of the fish oil was good And and
Mark: sure. Good stuff.
Oscar Serrallach: and and I was like I need to learn more about this And not just from a someone telling me about it but from an experiential point of view And was when we went to Bali now cause I've been doing yoga nidra but just it'd be 20 minutes a couple of times a week just and you mentioned Yogi before I'm a very on off yogi so
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: practice for a couple of [00:17:00] months Don't for a couple of months And I'm at peace with that And my Yoga Nidra was like that And then going to Berlin doing your course and doing and I don't know sometimes we're doing it three or four times per day
Mark: That's a.
Oscar Serrallach: and it just sent me out into this realm of experience And then I think I shared with you my a ring that I was wearing was telling me I was in deep sleep during my yoga nra And I was like no I'm not asleep I'm just relaxed And I was like wow if this can almost trick my aura ring into thinking I'm in deep sleep profound Um
Mark: something going on around here. Yeah. Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: and it was just confirmation more than anything and there Is increasing research coming outta Yoga Nidra the world's
Mark: Mm.
Oscar Serrallach: neuroscientist Andrew Huberman you may be aware of he loves Yoga Nidra for different reasons that perhaps
Mark: Mm
Oscar Serrallach: [00:18:00] do he's much more interested in the
Mark: sure.
Oscar Serrallach: space and
Mark: Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: but it just shows you it's got many
Mark: Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: aspects to it
Mark: Many applications. That was one of the great things about yoga nidra is that you Huberman, as you mentioned, he's very much that biohacking row culture, I call it, you know, we wanna make, it's very American. We're gonna make ourselves better. I wanna become this optimized version of myself. And it's, you know, hacking the system, which is great.
, He's got a very strong following of, what do they call Huberman husbands, all these men who just fall in love and follow him. But look, if it's, if it's getting all these women talk about their huberman husbands like, oh, my husband's, you know, he's following Andrew Huberman.
But it's, look, if it's getting people to slow down, and he's, you know, again, very American, rebranded it as NSDR, non Sleep Deep Rest. He's interested in connecting it to hypnotherapy, which is a really interesting leap that he's made because there is obviously within the use of Sankalpa, but there's a strong connection there.
But what you and I are very [00:19:00] much sharing, I think, is this. A, the love of the tradition, the yoga tradition is we've come out of this traditional practice of yoga nidra, but also appreciating the blessing, the deep blessing of this repeated practice of slowing down
Oscar Serrallach: Yep
Mark: and coming into that, that experience of, of quietude.
And, and that's, it's, it's magic. I, I can't explain it in any other way for people who are busy brains. And I must certainly fit into that category, the capacity, the skill to be able to come into this No mind state where, so you mentioned before, you can clearly show that the body's in fact asleep, but my mind is, is still conscious, but there's almost an absence and, and some of the research has shown that like that yoga nidra is dropping as deep into this delta state where there's almost no thought.
And that is magic. That's what the yogis sort of get to of this. [00:20:00] They talk about ria, this timeless place and for me psychologically enables everything to sort of decompress. But physiologically, as I'm sure you could perhaps share with us, it's been shown that once you get into that space, that's where the deep healing can really happen.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah And it's not about the Yoga Nidra it's about the space that you go into with Yoga Nidra that sort of does the healing and
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: and if you look at these yogis they were the OG biohackers
Mark: Yeah. Indeed. Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: they weren't just they weren't proclaiming it but they and yoga is a real science when you're looking at what the definition of science really is because it's a complete system my concern is when you take one element out of a complete system and utilize it are you going to lose something along the way
Mark: probably.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah Yeah it you definitely can and you one of my deep insights especially during your training mark [00:21:00] was now the whole point of Asana is to get you ready for meditation And the whole point of meditation is to get you ready for nidra And that's part of the science as it were of how Yoga as a complete system is designed to work And obviously there are many other aspects to that in interwoven
And I've always been curious going okay if we're not moving our body correctly it's gonna be harder to then get the benefits from something like Yoga Ni I think the Arsen is just about trying to teach the body how to more in alignment and in harmony
Mark: Yes, absolutely.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah
Mark: It's all, look, I I, I wouldn't wanna take out one spoke of the wheel, but I think understanding that you're not gonna handstand your way to enlightenment. It's just not gonna happen. Or back bend, or forward bend or whichever bend twist you, you're trying to do. But there are schools of yoga who, and I participated in that for a long time, thinking that these [00:22:00] advanced yogas were the people doing the incredible drop backs and, you know, the pre pretzel moves and whatever, they were incredibly dextrous or strong.
It's really impressive stuff and it's beautiful to see and beautiful to practice, but it is only a part of the package. Once you begin to experience pranayama and the tantric methodology and bringing in bandhas and mudras into practice takes it to a whole different dimension, and then coming into this quieter practice, they cross-pollinate.
So my Yoga Nidra, in fact, supports. My asana practice, my meditation supports, my yoga nidra, et cetera, et cetera. They're all marinating in this big soup, which helps to make it truly wonderful.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah It's not com compartmentalized and not but it's all integrated System and the
Mark: Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: AYA Yama is very much essential in that And now all the research is showing awareness is part of being able to get into [00:23:00] relaxation
Mark: Absolutely. Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: and I read somewhere that the ancient yogis worked out 11 ways to hack into the vagus
Mark: okay.
Oscar Serrallach: And most of us just use the main one which is the breathing
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: But no as that they do other quite complex things including bits of cord and pulling them back up and what have you And that's just another way to stimulate the vagus in a healthy way I'm not recommending any of the necessarily but the breath
Mark: Sure, sure.
Oscar Serrallach: one that's easily accessible
Mark: Yeah. It's probably the quickest and most accessible it's hard natural breath awareness is, it's not easy to sit there and attend to the breath. And I've, I've got a theory that that's why a lot of the other stuff was invented, just to keep us attentive because we are humans have disparate minds, and we need almost more stimulation and more exploration so we can come back to that final practice, which in fact is [00:24:00] natural breath awareness or a simple mantra of practice, which I think for a lot of peoples is a standup practice.
And what I've found, having done , a vast array of practice and still do fairly sophisticated practice at time, but it is, it is the simple things. I come back to again and again and Yoga Nidra very much is one of them. I've often said I, I wouldn't want to have to do this, but if I had to hand back all my toys and I could only keep one toy, it would be Yoga Nidra.
If I could only do one practice ongoing. And it's, it is the practice for me that keeps me, I keep coming back to, and I just, I've, I've heard you say before, it's as far as bang for buck. It's, it's the best thing going around.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah and I'd a hundred percent agree if I only had one tool in my toolbox it would be Yoga Nidra And for my time poor exhausted mothers that I'm working with they don't have the space to be navel [00:25:00] gazing and I'm very honest with them look if we can get 20 minutes where you're able to aside and start relaxing can we make 18 minutes of that really good stuff
Mark: Mm.
Oscar Serrallach: than empty minded meditation or even as beautiful as a gratitude practice is it's not necessarily that immediate and you have to really embody it And so from a very busy
Mark: Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: exhausted moms it's this is why it's got voted the most useful thing out of all the things that I've been trying over the years And
Mark: Yeah. So good. So good. It's I had a, a couple of my teachers guru pre who was, the author of a book called Mother is First Guru. I dunno if you ever picked that up. It was old school yoga book, but talking it was very much about mothering and integrating yoga practice into the journey of motherhood.
And she would just go [00:26:00] on and on and on about, and she ran a lot of, I was you, I wasn't involved in her mother's groups, but she ran for a long time. Another teacher Radha Vine, these were in Sydney too. Yoga teachers I knew who'd both sort of taught at the mangrove yoga ashra. And, and they just would rave and rave about yoga nidra of like, it is if, if you are seeing people who are pregnant, you know, they would just, you need to learn now.
You need, you need to get this part of your practice now. I mean, a, it's gonna help your, your pregnancy, but it's really gonna come into play postpartum. So, can I talk a to you a little bit more about your journey to get to where you are as a. Man but a father of, of and supportive of, of, you've got a beautiful wife and, and you've supported her on her journey of, of motherhood, but what, what really drove you to get to that point going, no, this is actually what I really wanna do.
Oscar Serrallach: And in terms of motherhood and I've really got skin in the game as essay say[00:27:00]
Mark: Mm,
Oscar Serrallach: three kids and I was working in I was the main doctor in Nimbin for eight years So it it's a remote town that's about an hour inland from Byron Bay
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: And we decided to start a family there and my introduction to the home birth world was a starting point for me just to crack open my rigid mind shall we say because I wasn't really open to any of that stuff previously because I was the main doctor in the small town I could see everything And so I gotta see the mothers coming in complaining of exhaustion I I got to see the community nurse would go out and visit them What They had to set there No there wasn't Anyone else to be managing them or supporting them through their journey And I was just seeing similar themes everywhere And then including with Caroline my partner and I was like oh there's a pattern here Okay let's just go or by [00:28:00] the textbook and I'll learn more about it And lo and behold there's no textbook wasn't then still isn't now in terms of what's really going on neurobiologically hormonally metabolically and from a nervous system point of view from others and this whole world of psycho neuro immunology which is combining all of these and they're actually journals that have titled that But you can't differentiate your mind from your hormonal system from your metabolism and from your immune system There's so much overlap And we know we can get ourselves so stressed that we can cause ourselves gastritis or a cold sort of pop up or we're very familiar with at least some of the manifestations of those things
Mark: Sure.
Oscar Serrallach: and yeah and I'm just Person also wanted to help my [00:29:00] clients really wanted to understand and help support Caroline it just started me on a journey of just looking at information and after I realized there wasn't much in the medical space but once you're six weeks postpartum the system just goes look baby's You're alive
Mark: Yep.
Oscar Serrallach: you're
Mark: Okay. We're done.
Oscar Serrallach: from a physical point of view And it's a similar process Six six months in terms of psychological challenges And we know that motherhood is forever It doesn't stop at six weeks after the baby's born and now all the new research it it showing that how a mother's brain Is forever changed and profound ways that are meant to be good but it's a vulnerable change And so this idea of my trence the becoming of a mother adolescence the becoming of an adult there's a lot of similarities hormonally brain change wise and this time of vulnerability afterwards And things don't always go to plan in terms of the recalibration of the brain And this is [00:30:00] what we are seeing in western culture with mothers that the recalibration hasn't to plan things are out of tune And the only one I'm really aware to get it back in to tune is through the nervous system whilst supporting nutrition nutrients supplements sleep relationship health all of those kind of things
and the body has a hierarchy and whether we like it or not nervous system is at the top of the hierarchy
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: What people don't realize is all your hormones the initial signal is decided in your brain and signals are sent out to the glands that then produce hormones
Mark: Isn't that an interesting revelation? I'm just gonna jump in there, because this idea of hierarchy is, it was always the mind, I need to fix my mind and then I fix everything else. Or the alternative, I'm gonna go the other way. I'm gonna fix my body. But this idea of the hierarchy, in fact is the nerves.
It's the first [00:31:00] response, the first responder, to any sense, input is our nervous system. And tuning into that awareness, I'm thinking is probably really key to understanding how we can set ourselves up for really true sense of wellbeing.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah totally And the brain is the headquarters pun intended of the nervous system and so all our hormones are decided by the brain And when people say it's all in your head they're being unkind But ironically there there is this a big spike of truth there in terms of it all is happening in your head in terms of and a lot of your metabolic signaling also starts in the head So in terms of your body utilizes you energy substrates and glucose and those kind of things it's and then not all but a lot of your immune system is also [00:32:00] governed by the brain
Mark: Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: And then that affects basically everything we experience
Mark: Yes. Absolutely. . We are talking yoga, meditation practice of working on Ajna chakra first, which is essentially stabilizing the brain, you know, and, and crossover with. That's the first port of call in, in the classical tantric teaching. The yogas have known this for forever. Work on this first.
Ajna quite literally means the command center and that you focus on that first and then you built before you start to really get too stuck into the body because that it sets us up to make good decisions. So balancing the nervous system, balancing the mind, everything can come from that.
Oscar Serrallach: and what the ancients talked about but didn't know is that each of these chakras corresponds to a hormonal production
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: in that hierarchy
Mark: Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: So when we are
Mark: [00:33:00] yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: talking the third eye that's the pineal gland talking to the hypothalamus and
Mark: Quite literally the command center.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah exactly it's we all this information's going in being processed and then sent out in terms of a response And so given that the body doesn't get it wrong it's just doing what it thinks is required given the information that's coming in And if you are feeling overwhelmed and undersleep and not supported that's the information that's going into your brain And then your body is going to respond in various ways but it eventually becomes a decompensation where the body goes into a more of a protection mode And that's where chronic fatigue mental health issues addiction And it is probably the basis for things like autoimmune disease and other things in terms of at least the match that starts the fire
Mark: [00:34:00] yeah, so look, I, I know that you support, , you run a clinic and, and you do have a lot of mothers who you work with directly and have done you're based out of Byron Bay and I guess you probably work online as well, and you also run groups courses as well. But, and I think you're also running now courses to educate other medical professionals.
Is that right?
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah that's so that's relatively recent so to start this year but to get this information and I've just been very lucky to basically have started this journey as all the neurobiology understanding of the human maternal brain started the first significant medical paper on the internal workings of the human maternal brain was in 2017
Mark: Wow, that's not long ago.
Oscar Serrallach: no My book came out in 2018 And so I was just this just been very fortunate to ride that wave and be [00:35:00] introduced to information and people that have really supported my journey And then my journey now is to then educate and help support others And so I've done a lot of courses with mothers regarding this and now moving to the health professionals that deal with mothers
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: And so the course is called Matreatrics It's a made up word I've made that up
Mark: Good word.
Oscar Serrallach: made up words can help with concepts but we've
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: geriatrics of the elderly pediatrics of the young For example
Mark: Yeah,
Oscar Serrallach: should be in their own Medical group because
Is showing Yeah no you're not the same on so many levels and even your health risks change as a consequence of becoming a mother mostly for the better but not always And Matriatrics is what the course is called and I'm loving it it's going super well And and slowly just building a community [00:36:00] of like-minded practitioners who to think outside their traditional medical school training but incorporate science this is our doctors always feel much more comfortable when there's a lot of science behind us to support our recommendations So
Mark: Yeah. And, and, and good because you're science professionals, like there's a, it's so interesting. It wasn't that long ago that no doubt some of the stuff that you were exploring and suggesting was considered to be anti-science. Isn't it lovely that you can actually now just teach and instruct and support people with the stuff that you've always instinctively known was good, but now you've got the science, the good science, and more increasing the amounts of science and that there's energy.
And look thanks to Andrew Huberman and not exclusively, but he's certainly done a huge amount to really popularize. I I think he's [00:37:00] instigated a lot of research and attention going into some of these areas particularly around the sort of stuff that I'm interested in breath work, yoga, Yoga Nidra, et cetera.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah
Mark: I know that there's, they're currently doing some research, ongoing research into Yoga Nidra, which is very cool.
I can't wait to see, I mean, those guys have got access to good money and, and lots of fun toys to play with. No doubts. It'd be really interesting to see what they come out with there.
Oscar Serrallach: and they speak the language of science to help other
Mark: hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: people which is also important And a really good example of that Mark is the microbiome not only of the gut that was considered to be a bit witchy
Mark: indeed.
Oscar Serrallach: ago
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: it's front and center of so much of our health journey
Mark: Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: And even though how to modulate and manipulate the microbiomes is not straightforward it's not it's hardcore science [00:38:00] Now
Mark: Yeah. Yeah. And look, most psychologists are talking about, I remember it wasn't that long ago, I was actually working for a big disability support organization. It was about 10 years ago now, and we had a behavioral support team and they were, they were psychologists and, and they were good psychologists and they were behavioral support specialist, you know, a specializing in behavioral psychology.
And, and we. Were helping to develop behavioral support plans for people with challenging behaviors in the mental health and disability space and with intellectual disability, et cetera. So they, I remember having a, and I had just sort of finished my meditation training, yoga training, and I was starting to really teach actively.
And I had fairly a number of fairly passionate conversations with the head of that department who was a clinical psych and saying, look, could we not be bringing some mindfulness aspects into? And he was just like, no, gold standard is c cognitive behavioral therapy and medication. That's what, and that's all he wanted to talk about.
I was like, a little bit of [00:39:00] meditation, a little bit of breathing, maybe something and like, nah, nah, nah. If he said that now, he'd probably lose his job, you know, because if you're a psychologist in today's world and you're denying that meditation is really useful, the gold standard has changed.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah
Mark: med meditation, mindfulness is now part of it.
Oscar Serrallach: Oh very much And that's the 20th century paradigm we just stick with certain things and and we don't deviate from that And now in the 21st century we're understanding we still have to stay with science but there's so much more that science has shown us regarding how to support people's journeys whether it be physical health issues or mental health issues or both
Mark: Yes. And this relationship between microbiome, the brain and the gut. It's, it's a really interesting journey that, again, yogis have known out, known about for quite a long period of time, and science is now showing us how we can best support that and how we can [00:40:00] really optimize our mental health through Look, it can just start with really just eliminating simple things in your diet, optimizing gut health.
It's, it's a really big part of the gen and obviously say, you know, cognitive behavior therapy and, and the other modalities are really useful too. But when you start to build cohesive protocols, which introduce different elements, you've just optimizing results.
Oscar Serrallach: Oh exactly And a lot of this is rediscovering what the yogis and ancient cultures knew but providing new insights
Mark: Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: I even Hippocrates the supported father of medicine he's got two great quotes It was over 2000 years ago Food is thy medicine most people have heard And then his other classic is death begins in the Colon and know
Mark: I haven't heard that.
Oscar Serrallach: and not knowing about the microbiome and mucosal degradation and short chain fatty acids It didn't help modulate the immune system [00:41:00] and brain neurotransmitters and everything that we're just discovering now about about the good and the bad of the microbiome But there was just an observation Is there something about when things start to go wrong in the belly the body starts to age much quicker and starts to have more problems And and I think the yogis were like were very observational but then had a system The yogic system which is a type of science to build on people's observations over generations And something that you talked a lot about Mark's importance of lineage and it took me a while to really appreciate why lineage isn't so important But it's for me the core of it is and you can correct me if I'm going down the wrong path here but it's about almost the purity of information But people have been working so hard in terms of their insights that that not about reinterpreting or and [00:42:00] matching It's about taking that core knowledge you can add to that but you need to be in the space of that deep observation if it gets or tainted it's like information on your hard drive It needs to be copied correctly And each generation is like trying to copy information to the next collective hard drive so to speak
Mark: Yeah. Yeah, that's lineage is really important. That it, the, what we explore with yoga is it goes back a very long way. And look, I have interpreted what's been taught to be by my teachers. I'm teaching out of the such an under lineage, which connects to the Shivan under lineage, which goes all the way back to Shanka, Chaia and, and back ultimately to Shiva.
That's, they, they say the shiva is the ade guru. You know, it came from this download from, from the heavens. The, the importance there is that I, I'm in, I'm no by, [00:43:00] by no means bound to teach by that certain method and, and teach that practice exactly was, was taught to me. In fact, I don't often, I will. Amend and adjust and, and teach things in a way that is suit more suitable to say, if I'm teaching others, I'm gonna, I'm, I don't need to burden them with all of the stuff about, you know, all the mantras and all this.
I want to teach RA in a way that's really specific and useful to them. So they're gonna get the maximum impact, but I need to know where it came from so I don't feel like a need to make it up and embellish and understanding. It's interesting. Cuman is a good example where he sort of rebranded yoga nidra called it NSDR, very much focused on this biohacking idea he's missing.
I see. I hear him talk a lot about yoga nidra and I've listened to a lot of stuff. I've never heard him talk about God. I've never heard him talk about this experience of ria, which is really only accessible when you've done a fair bit of [00:44:00] yoga nidra practice a longer practice, and this opportunity that's available to experience complete stillness that can get missed.
That's easy to, oh, you know what, I've roll out my heart rate, my breathing, all these different markers are, I'm, I'm improving myself. But don't miss the big one. That yoga is in fact about connecting to Shiva back to the back through the lineage.
Oscar Serrallach: One aspect Andrew Cuban is introducing a Trojan horse for people to get in touch with their divinity which is I think for me what it's really
Mark: Absolutely love it. Yes. Yeah, I'm, I'm, look, I'm all for it. Just because if you, because if. Hundreds of millions of people connect to NSDR. They're like, wow, cool. If look, I'm all for that. Just, just, just lower the heart rates and, and let's just slow down a little bit. It's gonna have a really profound impact on the world.
But if you know a very small percentage of them can, and it's always generally a very small percentage, you go, you know what? I wanna know more. [00:45:00] And we need to know that if they go looking for more, that more is available, that we can actually still trace back through the lineage and they can find themself.
The, you know, the, the core text of yoga really haven't changed very much. The yoga sutures is still the perennial text of the yoga tradition. It hasn't changed very much. And the reason it hasn't changed very much is because no one's written anything better. It's still the best thing available. And I've read it cover to cover.
I've read lots of books about yoga, meditation, most of them. In fact, there is still nothing that is, and it's. It's beautiful in its simplicity. It's, it doesn't extrapolate on the ideas, it introduces the little synopsis of, it's a sutro, it's a little, it's a thread of an idea that you as a, as a student and as a teacher can begin to interpret and explain.
So yeah, that is the ultimately the importance of lineage, which look for PEs many people, you don't need to go down the whole journey, but it's nice to know that the stuff that you've, you're [00:46:00] exploring, it's been tested. If you're experiencing practicing yoga nidra, you can know that those techniques have been refined by some really smart people over a long period of time.
I do have another question for you. I'd, I'd actually like to, I'm aware of, of time, and I just want to, assuming that people are gonna listen to this podcast and there's gonna be some mothers out there or people who are supporting mothers. You've done a lot of work, as I mentioned before, and we discussed with mothers individually and in groups and educating others.
What, what are your key protocols that you recommend? Is there sort of a, a call, what did you call it before?
The magic approach. What is the magic approach?
Oscar Serrallach: The ma the magic approach involves any nutritional deficiencies so that's very hard to get if your iron's low for example maybe it's gonna be a
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: harder [00:47:00] process So just
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: nutritional deficiencies trying to explore what sort of diet works better for you without it becoming a full-time
Mark: the sort of stuff that could be done with a doctor or, or a naturopath and could do some testing, get some understanding of levels,
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah Yeah
Mark: little bit of consultation be really helpful there.
Oscar Serrallach: have to be too elaborate It's just we can eat a slightly less inflammatory diet that's going to help where we are And then if you're feeling better you can start exploring those sort of things more then once we have a foundation we can then start looking at the nervous system And the nervous system really involves sleep And then you know what I've actually started using this term not realizing it came from Andrew Huberman nons sleep depressed which is been deeply relaxing during the day but not being asleep
Mark: AKA ra.
Oscar Serrallach: and our umbrella concept at the [00:48:00] clinic and If we have a look at it from a polyvagal theory point of view we're designed to be more relaxed than we are stressed at our baseline So if you kinda look at the sympathetic versus parasympathetic we need to be slightly more relaxed parasympathetic system then we are stressed sympathetic at our baseline things are happening We know you need that activation you need sympathetic But when things come back down and most people who are retre including most of the mothers that I see that's not the case they're slightly more stressed than they are relaxed at their baseline And so the of the magic approach is retraining the nervous system So it's like going to the gymnasium if you're and if you're not
very. And for me yoga is a perfect neural gymnasium if you like cause it's got all the aspects there that it is good for the nervous system the breath work the asana the [00:49:00] yoga nidra and we just need to start somewhere And so part of our umbrella concept is tiny things frequently small things every day things once a week and bigger things once in a while that refers
Mark: it.
Oscar Serrallach: timeframes of getting more relaxed in your are stress So tiny things might
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: seconds and just doing that as many times during the day as you can And the research is really clear Breath awareness and a sense of presence You need those two things
Mark: Beautiful. Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: is having a cup of tea smell the cup of tea So that's bringing a physical sense to bring you into a present state It's not natural for the brain to be present The brain's always thinking about the near future and then just forrests and forres breaths out We know that slow even out breath is the best part of[00:50:00]
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: And don't be too elaborate about it Just do it and then just move on Back to the chaos That's okay that's a tiny thing And that's very much like putting a coin into a piggy bank more coins you put in you the better that the piggy
Mark: Yeah. I often talk about the, the, so the, the, the microdosing of meditation and, and just that simple breath of the sip, sip, side breath. Are you familiar with that one? I'm sure I've done it with you. The inhale. Inhale, ah, beautiful little nervous system reset that you can do
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah
Mark: 10 times a day.
Oscar Serrallach: nervous system Exactly And and doing those tiny things is helpful but we need other things And so a small thing 20 minutes once a day and these are minimums you want to
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: And so yoga nidra is a perfect thing for that
Mark: Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: cause if you're exhausted and your mind's racing like crazy good luck with open-minded meditation
Mark: [00:51:00] yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: trying to really get into a gratitude practice where you're feeling it at a deep core Even those both of those things are super valid And then just trying to work out a structure where you can get 20 minutes to away from kids and yeah And all the trappings of mom life a week doing 60 minutes
Mark: Okay.
Oscar Serrallach: three things we typically recommend that are easy easier massage and restorative yoga
Mark: Okay, great. Yeah,
Oscar Serrallach: types of yoga good for lots of things but not necessarily for what we're looking at in terms of more relaxed than you are
Mark: yeah, yeah. Restorative could also be y yid yoga, which is phenomenally popular. It's amazing how people just, just clam for, 'cause I think they scream for it and they, you get a taste of that. Your nervous system gets a taste of the deep parasympathetic let down that [00:52:00] amazing feeling of the ventral vagal system.
Just, it's, it's, it's what we, so many of us, me very much included. I dunno how much I need it until I've done it and I'm go, oh, that's what I needed.
Oscar Serrallach: E Exactly and I'll share a story just from a few weeks ago I had a client come in going oh I love the yoga nidra I'm doing it wrong And I'm like how can you be doing it wrong tell me And she said I only hear the beginning and the end and then I fall asleep And I'm like that's exactly what you are after because your brain's still listening But when you go into a deep state of relaxation your brainwave activity goes somewhere between alpha and theta and you lose a sense of time and place And this is What we're after with these the 20 minute 60 minute things
Mark: Mm.
Oscar Serrallach: And
Mark: Yeah. It's interesting. A lot of people report that feeling, oh, I fell asleep. I'm not getting it. It's like there's evidence and, and you and [00:53:00] I have discussed this in the past. There's I think that Swedish yoga score, I think that's Swedish. They did an interesting study where they were testing people.
Are they actually Oh, people when they're reporting being asleep, the evidence shows that most people in fact, aren't asleep. Although they might think they're asleep. They're in fact not asleep.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah and that's the magic That's why it's called nons sleep Deep rest And it's just that your memory in that deep place gets switched off And that's why we have
Mark: Amazing.
Oscar Serrallach: Kind of gap But brain's hearing all the instructions those kind of things if you
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: Two hours after your yoga knee drink
Mark: You are probably asleep. Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: on the pillow and you're wrapped up in your headphone
Mark: Yeah,
Oscar Serrallach: went to sleep
Mark: and you probably needed that sleep, so don't, don't feel bad about that either. But yeah, the, the ultimate test, if you do wake up with the instruction to come back, then you, in fact, were asleep because you were still receiving and responding to those instructions. So you are you, you, you, your [00:54:00] client she's doing it perfectly, right?
Oscar Serrallach: Exactly So rather than she felt like she was a poor student I was like no that's what we're after That's exactly what we're
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: And for the 60 minute thing once a week it's also important to go to that space so when we're talk about yin yoga start of yoga we almost need to have that experience like we have with Shavasana And I was like oh my God I went somewhere Because that's one of the I think almost key experiences of being a very deep relaxed space We lose a sense of time and place and tick We can say that Whatever you did well that was great
Mark: Beautiful, beautiful. I feel just thinking my way through that protocol, I, I,
Oscar Serrallach: Well
Mark: optimistic and,
Oscar Serrallach: and then the last part of that protocol and this is where your work comes in mark is a bigger thing once in a while is a three to [00:55:00] five day retreat like experience not a family holiday with the kids
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: and so a lot of mothers when if they have whatever if there's away it's going holiday with the kids and that's not going to really It's probably gonna make the sympathetic overactivation worse
Mark: You might have fun, but it's not r and r, no.
Oscar Serrallach: I've heard so many mothers say it's just work in a different environment with less tools
Mark: Yes, yes. Okay.
Oscar Serrallach: I've heard that enough time going that's the experience of most moms on a holiday And
Mark: Sure. Yep.
Oscar Serrallach: And so and this is outside of having really small kids um
Mark: Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: but can a mother have a retreat like experience once a year And this is where yoga retreats because they're more common than other types of retreats typically And they're much more focused on there's all the science behind it It's not necessarily going on a biohacking or [00:56:00] Vim Hof retreat or something that may not get you to that relaxed place
Mark: Yeah. Yeah, there's something really powerful about a concentrated experience coming together with a group who of like-minded individuals, building sunga as well. Those friendships you make in those experiences are really important. You know, the people, whether that's another group of mothers or just a group of friends, people on, on that same path and like have, in my experience, yoga teacher training courses, yoga retreats, whatever it is, coming together for a period of time, particularly when you're extracted from the world a little bit.
It reminds us what's really important,
Oscar Serrallach: Exactly
Mark: you might go back to back to the chaos.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah It reminds us of our values It can help reset the nervous system to some degree and then back to the cow Exactly And I've had a number of mothers do Vipassana and I think a lot of the time [00:57:00] as great as Vipassana is it's much of a jump for what The nervous system needs and it needs to be something softer more restorative and there's always time
Mark: Are amazing. Just so people dunno, vipasana is, is what Oscar's talking about, is this, this amazing offering through the Goenke, sk Goenke tradition where you can go away in various parts of the world and do a a 10 day supported meditation sit, which I would say it's, it's diving into the deep end of the pool.
A lot of people have never done any meditation before. Go. I'm just gonna start there because it's really readily available. It's, it's sort of funded. You, they offer it by donation, so it's relatively affordable. And I did it a a number of times. In fact, I had hardly done any meditation and just dived in and went, I'll give it a go, and just struggled my way through it, which was, I really appreciate having done that.
However, I've realized over time that there are slightly more gentle approaches and, and particularly for people who are already exhausted, there might be something a little bit [00:58:00] more, a little bit more middle path that that might be more appropriate.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah And in in that sort of nervous system gymnasium analogy it's like going to the heavy weights
Mark: Yeah,
Oscar Serrallach: end of the gym rather than maybe something a bit more gentle yeah there's always
Mark: just start on the treadmill. Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: The extra cycle and exactly Don't don't start with the heavy lifting
Mark: Yeah. Okay. So, but you know, in some way, shape or form those little moments, you know, and as, as a partner perhaps supporting a mother on their journey, really valuing that for that person to be able to step away and, and have that time. It's important. It's important, you know, for sustainable families. I, I've got a, the, the overarching theme of this podcast, Oscar, is that the gentle revolution, which is very much for me, it's about creating sustainable humanity.
So the idea of a, I think it's called, it's the [00:59:00] gentler e evolution. So we don't have to bump into things before we actually learn how to change. , That's why I got into meditation. I used to be a, a journalist and, and was very interested in politics and, and social endeavors, and I really wanted to, to create a better world and world.
What I've realized over time is through regulated human beings create what we need first to create. You might have the smartest, most capable human beings in the world, but if they're not emotionally regulated, we're still gonna have a lot of problems and supporting motherhood at the course, at the epicenter of the human experience, right?
So it's something that we must, we all must circle around and go, how can we support mothers and fathers and families, but motherhood? Has been neglected. And, and we need to rally round and support, make motherhood and mothers successful, and make them harmonious and happy. Help them to be,
Oscar Serrallach: And if we want [01:00:00] emotionally well-regulated leaders they will
Mark: hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: come from families that emotionally well regulated And that initially comes from the mother baby sort of relationship So the mothers are fundamental the evolution of healthy humans and obviously the parents wellbeing And then there are kind of layers around that But in in the middle of the onion so to speak is the mother And then just to talk to your point about gentle revolution what I love is that the word revolution means to revol back to a previous state
Mark: Ooh,
Oscar Serrallach: if it's
Mark: I didn't, I didn't even know that.
Oscar Serrallach: So re evolving So
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: we're moving to a new that's evolution If we are moving to something new and it obviously in common terminology revolution revolting it just it's it [01:01:00] more militant and overthrowing but at its core it's about going back to a previous state where there wasn't this issue or this problem or the specific thing that we're butting up against And nothing's perfect No yoga is not perfect But I think it is whole and complete and it's a really good focus point if we're going to revol but we don't wanna revol To something that isn't so healthy but
Mark: Mm,
Oscar Serrallach: is good for the planet good for humans and is gonna be part of the or help to contribute to the solution and not to the or the problems that we are facing at the
Mark: yes. Yeah. As, as one of my dear teachers Swami used to say that Yogis are [01:02:00] ambassadors for the peace, ambassadors for peace. And as a teacher, a, a teacher of peace, showing people how to be peaceful, introduce how to be peaceful within ourselves, that's where it starts. I feel harmonious and peaceful.
Oscar Serrallach: yeah without internal peace it's a lot harder to manifest societal piece isn't it yeah
Mark: It really is. Yeah, it really is. Well, look, I think we should wrap it there. I'm aware of time is a, well, it's an illusion, but you know, we've both got clocks ticking. I know that you certainly do. And you're a busy guy and I really appreciate the time that you've taken to join me today and share your message.
And on a bigger picture. As your journey as an ambassador for Peace. I would like to ask you one more question, though. It's a personal question. How's your Yoga Nidra practice? It's something like where I caught up with you a few weeks ago as well. 'cause you know, as you said before, you've studied with me, I've been your, your teacher, and it really excites [01:03:00] me when I see someone grab a practice and go, oh, bringing this into my life.
Particularly a discerning individual such as yourself. So could you share a little bit about what your personal practice looks like?
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah certainly So that's something I'm pretty regular with So to be honest I'm probably doing Yoga Nidra four to five times per week And for me it works best around the middle of the day just before I'm having my natural slump and energy not and I can it's like a reset I'm I've got good energy for the rest of the afternoon at work I lie on the examination table and we'll do it there my staff are very used to not trying to resuscitate me That's
Mark: It's okay.
Oscar Serrallach: we'll be concerned And I've got a collection of different apps on my phone and I just sometimes what am I up for today I'm I've and I think one of the things with Yoga Nidra we [01:04:00] need to be really discerning There's a lot of things out there that I don't think are yoga nidra that have the label And
Mark: Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: concerns me about that is one they they just I don't feel them working
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: and they em sometimes quite irritating also And then I think it's giving Yoga nidra not sure a bad name but almost like a neutral name it's taking out and I always use a fairly firm surface I can't do yoga nidra in bed for example
Mark: [01:05:00] Mm-hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: really talks about our life work is just trying to make the best sound culpa we can possibly make
Mark: Just a stpa is a resolve that we make in yoga nidra. So it's a really important tool that we bring into our yoga nidra practice. I, I often talk about it as a superpower, you know, this, it
gives us the ability to really refine our intention and as community decide, says, you know, really evolve into that best version of, of who we are.
Oscar Serrallach: well and it's an essential ingredient for yogi nidra So if you're not having similar it's like not using salt in your cooking you're missing out on something that's pretty fundamental
Mark: Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: and I really enjoy working just slowly improving that over months and years What really resonates and gives gives me like a body tingle when I internally say it going okay that's actually feeling really good because it's a [01:06:00] type of It's an honest experience It's not like I'm wanting a new car or a new house or the type self-affirmation or those kind of things when you know you're talking something it's very personal But when you are really feeling a good some culpa know the body reacts in a very kind of favorable way And so is there something I've been
Mark: Yeah,
Oscar Serrallach: it is not like I overthink it it's just in the moment what's I
Mark: yeah, yeah. Should ultimately speak to, I, you know, talk talks to us as being. Resonance. We're, we're, we're a vibration. And, and a San Culpa should speak to your highest vibration. And that's why we get that physical connection to it when it's true. This feeling of like, that's me. That's what, that is where I'm going to be best expressed, and that's how I'm gonna come through fulfilling that San Culpa, this, this resolve that we are making.
And it, it is, you've mentioned [01:07:00] before this connect with NSDR. Huberman talks about NSDR being yoga nidra and also hypnotherapy. And so that state you can get any difference with hypnotherapy usually gonna have someone else guide you in there. But we're, when introducing Culpa into Yoga Nidra, it becomes self hypnotherapy.
We're actually literally able to reseed our subconscious mind, which takes the p practice into this whole, it's, it's a way beyond just relaxing the nervous system right there. Right. We're literally reprogramming our DNA.
Oscar Serrallach: Well a hundred percent So this but to do that self-hypnosis we need to be quite relaxed And so the this is why the Sankalpa is not at the beginning or at the end It's in the kind of the right To get the mind and body relaxed introduce the Sankalpa and it can it is a type of self hypnosis I'm sure it is and the other thing I'll just before we finish mark you introduced me to the concept of [01:08:00] self yoga nidra And I remember when you first mentioned that I was a bit like a as if you can a little I'm always skeptical about things I think this is part of my medical training
Mark: Good
Oscar Serrallach: Um,
Mark: Starting point.
Oscar Serrallach: And once I actually started trying so no so I found myself on a whenever I'm on a plane for example or I had an MRI last year or maybe the year before I can't remember But no in the M mri I was just I did a self nidra and I was just so relaxed I totally forgot I was in the MRI machine
Mark: Mm.
Oscar Serrallach: they're pulling me out the gentleman says are you okay It was the knitting to wake me up and I was like no I'm totally fine and I've had MRIs before and they're not pleasant experiences
Mark: No. Terrible space to be. Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: And you
Mark: i've had one too. Not fun.
Oscar Serrallach: can find space and they're really noisy people [01:09:00] don't really tell you how war zone like noisy and MRI machine can be like
Mark: yes.
Oscar Serrallach: and Yes And yeah I just thought I'd mention that because that's been I don't necessarily recommend to people just to do self yoga nija but that's been personally something that I've really gotten a lot out because when I need to do it
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: where I've being on a plane you can't Just take your headphones into what can I see MRI technician Do you mind playing this yoga nidra track
Mark: yeah, I mean, a, a set of headphones is great that we've we're, you know, carrying it around a set of headphones with us most of the time. But that ability, I have to do the self yoga. If I wake up in the middle of the night, just do the body rotation and just bring myself back into, it's a really great way of transitioning back into sleep.
So, learning the look, if, if you're new to Yoga Nidra, I don't recommend just starting there. Like I do use a recording and learn more about the practice, but. People who've been doing it for a long period of time. And, and Oscar has been, and I [01:10:00] have been, that it's certainly a great thing to explore. And, and that was shared to me by one of my teachers saying, oh no, you should definitely learn how to guide yourself in.
And I've done that for a long period of time, and I still do that sometimes as I mentioned, particularly when I wake up in the middle of the night. But I also do use recordings. And you also do use recordings in Yoga Nidra as well, so it's a nice thing to,
Hmm.
Oscar Serrallach: It's just when I don't have access to the recording
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: I can understand why in the middle of the night it would actually would work really well Because if you're having to wake yourself up pick up the phone get the hit now you're already playing with fire in some ways
Mark: Yes. You want to keep us quiet as you can. You wake up and say, all right, I'm aware that I'm awake. I need to do the absolute minimum at this point to
Oscar Serrallach: Rather than ooh there are a few notifications on my phone here I'm awake I might as well you think
Mark: Yeah, that's a danger zone. That's a slippery slope.
Oscar Serrallach: exactly
Mark: Look, you, you did mention before that you are something of an occasional yogi, but then you've just [01:11:00] sort of contrasted that with sharing a fairly committed practice to yoga nidra. And, and, and I'm here to tell you that actually that, that that pinpoints you is a very dedicated yogi.
And that's something that's really interesting about yoga New J because it's so easy and because it's so accessible that people go, ah, it's, it's sort of a cheat code. It it, well, it is a cheat code, but it's very much the yoga practice. It's a high practice and it, I, I joke around people. So my yoga practice, it's an afternoon nap.
That is my yoga practice. And, and that is, I do other stuff as well, but I. If you are just gonna commit to a practice, you can have the whole journey with yoga nidra. It can take you a really long way. We talk about Sankalpa not to mention the nervous regulation and really beginning to unpack and understand the nuance of mind.
You can introduce other elements of mantra, et cetera, into Yoga Nidra practice as well. It is a powerhouse practice that has the [01:12:00] capacity to take us pretty much the whole way. There's, there's, there's not a lot of limitations to where Yoga Nidra, so it's not just a light, it's not just a light little relaxation practice.
It is a, a holistic system of, of really resetting ourselves and affirming where we want to go in our life and connecting with that purpose on a, on a cellular level.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah no 100 And as you said if we're only had one tool we're both in agreeance that it would be that
Mark: Yeah.
Oscar Serrallach: the reason why I
Mark: friend to have.
Oscar Serrallach: and on is when I do the breath work and is I find the yoga injury works more quickly more deeply
Mark: Yes.
Oscar Serrallach: and
Mark: Yeah, they're good friends. They're very good friends.
Oscar Serrallach: And I just have such incredible awe and humility just around the design To be able to work this out [01:13:00] over generations to pass on this knowledge And and it's so useful in the 21st century
Mark: So useful.
Oscar Serrallach: It's not like it's outdated no old stuff that isn't relevant in the world anymore ageless in in that regard And it's essential that people are doing things to recalibrate their nervousness and their sense of wellbeing so they can be more aligned with your truer purpose and truer sense of self
Mark: Mm.
Oscar Serrallach: cause it's like cleaning the windscreen You can actually see where you're going and I think for me that's one of the things I really appreciate about Yoga Nidra Is it Cleans the windscreen of mental clarity for me
Mark: Mm, beautiful. Beautiful. Helps us to make better decisions. You know, you can see where you're going. You can choose where you're going and really affirm with where you want to go, and all of you starts pushing in [01:14:00] that same direction. That's important. I think oftentimes we're like, oh, I kind of wanna go there, but I'm also, part of me is going there.
Part of me is going there. I'm veering all over the road that. A singular purpose. And this is the superpower of the yogi that I mentioned before, that once you've locked onto that Sankalpa, every part of you is, is it's a team. You know, we're all, all of me is working together.
Oscar Serrallach: Yeah
Mark: Well, look, thank you so much, Oscar.
I'm, I could just keep talking to you. You are a font of wisdom and you've just shared so much beautiful information today and, and in the course of our friendship over the years. You've shared so much information with me. So thank you so much for your inspiration and for the work that you do, and I look forward to talking to you again very soon.
If people wanna do, wanna contact you how's, how's the best way to do that?
Oscar Serrallach: It is through my website so droscarserralach.com and it's got all everything about [01:15:00] me on there in terms of courses and what whatever I'm up to So that's the one-stop shop
Mark: Right. And you, the name of your book, you did mention before that you'd written a book what is the name of your book?
Oscar Serrallach: it's called the Postnatal Depletion Cure
Mark: Okay,
Oscar Serrallach: it wa wasn't actually the title that I chose but that's what the book publishers thought would be quite good But there's not a disease and there's no cure It's more like I said the approach but it's it's done super well It's a self-help book for mothers is what
Mark: fantastic. Yep.
Oscar Serrallach: And and coming back at you too mark and I really appreciate you and what you do for our community and what you've done for me personally and this idea of the gentle revolution it's beautiful It really is what the world is needing more of and perhaps less of the other stuff that's taking all the air weights in terms of yeah And we don't need to go into
Mark: Yeah,
Oscar Serrallach: yeah
Mark: yeah, yeah. We're here for it. Vila [01:16:00] Revolution. Well, thank you so much. You have a beautiful afternoon and a blessed day, and I'll see you speak with you very, very soon.
Oscar Serrallach: Yep Thanks mark
Mark: Well, I do hope that you enjoyed that episode as much as I did. Dr. Oscar Lac is truly a really inspiring man . He's a friend, a co-facilitator, and a great inspirer. So if you wanna know more, , dr oscar lac.com, check him out. And as I mentioned at the beginning of the episode, if you are.
At all interested in joining our breath work, meditation, yoga, nira training. We've got training starting at the end of 2025, uh, August, September. Check out yogic meditation.net or bamboo yoga byron.com. Otherwise, please do like, share the episodes, follow along. There's lots of great episodes in [01:17:00] the pipeline.
It is a great pleasure to share the gentle revolution with you. Keep it alive. Hari Aum Tat Sat
